Hi Donald,
Firstly, I could not see anywhere to put this info, so I came up with ''Misc.'', I'm also not sure if this info is of any use to you.
I know you discussed Donald & Myles Livingstone on the old forum quite some time ago, I came across some info on Ancestry, suggesting that Donald was born at Kildalton, Isle of Islay 24 Sept. 1741, they do not list his parents.
They state that his wife, as was already known, was Christian Campbell, b. 2 Oct. 1743 @ Muirkirk, Ayrshire, her parents being John Campbell (no further info on him), & Isobel Wilson, b. 21 Sept. 1718 @ Selkirk, Roxburghshire.
They also list two sons called Donald, one born 1771, the second born 1774, the first appears to have been a twin brother of Margaret.
I've got copies of OPR's for Myles birth & marriage, birth is dated 27 Sept. 1775, OPR 525/00 0010 0010 0063 Lismore, Appin & Duror, marriage is dated 20 June 1812, OPR 536/00 0010 0063 Bowmore or Kilarrow.
Transcription of OPR is as follows;
Miles & Janet, Both natives of Morvairn & passengers on the schooner Staffa, were registered marriage & were married & sailed for America. (Spelling is exactly as on OPR).
If you do not already have copies of the OPR's, let me know, I'll forward them to you.
There is no verification that Donald was born at Kildalton, I thought it might be of interest, as Myles was known to be in the same area of Islay before emigrating, & my family have always said they had family who originated from Islay, before Mull, how they came up with this, I do not know, but maybe they were correct, & there was more movement around the islands in those days than we realise,
John
Misc.
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Canadian Livingstone
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Re: Misc.
Hi John,
Dont think the Kildalton Parish Livingstons of Islay having any connection to Miles or Myles Livingston and his Morvern cousin Donald Livingston son of Neil Livingston and his family resided on the Isle of Islay before heading for Lord Selkirks settlement in British North AMerica in the early 1800's. I think they were in Kilmeny or Kilarrow Parish but there are no parish records for this Donald Livingstons family there. His father was Neil Livingston and mother Ann who settled later in Red RIver in 1819.Ive looked. Just Miles Livingston and his wife Janets 1812 marriage which a researcher from Islay first pointed out to me some years ago. Yes Miles and his second wifeJanet Livingston of Morvern Parish, Argyllshire were married in June of 1812 and entered in the Parish book of Presbyterian Minister at Bowmore/Kilarrow Parish Isle of Islay a few days before the Schooner Staffa took them to the Port of Sligo,Ireland where a Hudson Bay Company vessel chartered by Lord Selkirk waited to take highlanders and some Irish to Hudsons Bay in British North America from where they would travel by small boats 700 miles southward to Lord Selkirks Settlement of Red River. The original Livingston party of original settlers in 1812 to the Colony aboard the Hudson Bay Company Vessel Robert Taylor were: Miles Livingston b. 1775 employee of Lord Selkirk, boatbuilder and carpenter by trade and subsequently a settler, his second wife Janet nickname Jessie Livingston b.abt. 1793, Donald Livingston 1796-1862, Miles teenage son from a first marriage and Red River colony laborer, Donald Livingston born abt. 1786 or 1791 a boatbuilder for the Red River Colony. Donald Livingston Boatbuilder a few years later in 1819 was joined by his fatther Neil Livingston, brother James, Hugh and other family members from Islay and Jura. Donald stated in a Red RIveer Colony deposition that he also was born at Morvern though the Red River Colony record recorded both Miles and Donald as being from Mull. This was a mistake based probably on the fact that the MIles and Donald and the other Livingstons were travelling to the settlement in 1812with a large number of highlanders from Mull.
The Red River Colony Records clearly indicate that my ancestor Miles Livingston was born in 1775 though they assumed he was from Mull. At the time of his 1812 marriage he indicated he and his wife were natives of MOrvern Parish. It was the late Baron Alastair Livingston the Clan Chief pointed out some years ago that the Isle of Lismore Parish records interestingly indicate that a Myles Livingston born in 1775 was baptised and likely born on the Isle of Lismore according to old Isle of Lismore Parish records. The Isle of Lismore where the CHief's family have resided for many centuries is adjacent to the Morvern on the mainland and it is conceivalble that my ancestor Miles Livingston whom the Red RIver Colony stated was born abt. 1775 could have been mistaken about being born in Morvern Parish and instead was actually born in neighbouring Lismore Parish. It is a curious coincidence that we have in the records two Miles Livingstons apparently born or baptised in 1775 in Western Argyllshire a few miles from each other. Not quite certain what to make of this.
Happy New Year
regards,
Donald
Dont think the Kildalton Parish Livingstons of Islay having any connection to Miles or Myles Livingston and his Morvern cousin Donald Livingston son of Neil Livingston and his family resided on the Isle of Islay before heading for Lord Selkirks settlement in British North AMerica in the early 1800's. I think they were in Kilmeny or Kilarrow Parish but there are no parish records for this Donald Livingstons family there. His father was Neil Livingston and mother Ann who settled later in Red RIver in 1819.Ive looked. Just Miles Livingston and his wife Janets 1812 marriage which a researcher from Islay first pointed out to me some years ago. Yes Miles and his second wifeJanet Livingston of Morvern Parish, Argyllshire were married in June of 1812 and entered in the Parish book of Presbyterian Minister at Bowmore/Kilarrow Parish Isle of Islay a few days before the Schooner Staffa took them to the Port of Sligo,Ireland where a Hudson Bay Company vessel chartered by Lord Selkirk waited to take highlanders and some Irish to Hudsons Bay in British North America from where they would travel by small boats 700 miles southward to Lord Selkirks Settlement of Red River. The original Livingston party of original settlers in 1812 to the Colony aboard the Hudson Bay Company Vessel Robert Taylor were: Miles Livingston b. 1775 employee of Lord Selkirk, boatbuilder and carpenter by trade and subsequently a settler, his second wife Janet nickname Jessie Livingston b.abt. 1793, Donald Livingston 1796-1862, Miles teenage son from a first marriage and Red River colony laborer, Donald Livingston born abt. 1786 or 1791 a boatbuilder for the Red River Colony. Donald Livingston Boatbuilder a few years later in 1819 was joined by his fatther Neil Livingston, brother James, Hugh and other family members from Islay and Jura. Donald stated in a Red RIveer Colony deposition that he also was born at Morvern though the Red River Colony record recorded both Miles and Donald as being from Mull. This was a mistake based probably on the fact that the MIles and Donald and the other Livingstons were travelling to the settlement in 1812with a large number of highlanders from Mull.
The Red River Colony Records clearly indicate that my ancestor Miles Livingston was born in 1775 though they assumed he was from Mull. At the time of his 1812 marriage he indicated he and his wife were natives of MOrvern Parish. It was the late Baron Alastair Livingston the Clan Chief pointed out some years ago that the Isle of Lismore Parish records interestingly indicate that a Myles Livingston born in 1775 was baptised and likely born on the Isle of Lismore according to old Isle of Lismore Parish records. The Isle of Lismore where the CHief's family have resided for many centuries is adjacent to the Morvern on the mainland and it is conceivalble that my ancestor Miles Livingston whom the Red RIver Colony stated was born abt. 1775 could have been mistaken about being born in Morvern Parish and instead was actually born in neighbouring Lismore Parish. It is a curious coincidence that we have in the records two Miles Livingstons apparently born or baptised in 1775 in Western Argyllshire a few miles from each other. Not quite certain what to make of this.
Happy New Year
regards,
Donald
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jmlivingstone
- Posts: 533
- Joined: Thu Sep 10, 2009 10:34 pm
Re: Misc.
Hi Donald,
I noticed there was a Myles Livingstone who married a woman called McPherson in the Morvern area, they had a son Archibald, born or baptised at Morvern on 03 May 1812.There is no additional info on this Myles, or his family.
There was another Myles Livingstone, resident in Greenock in late 1700's, he married either an Agnes or Anne Blair, they had at least three children, John b. Jan. 1792, Catherine b. Dec. 1787 & Mary b. 1789, there is no indication of where this family originated from. As the only place Myles seems to appear as a Livingstone surname, is around Morvern, there is a fairly good chance they also came from the same area, also, Greenock had an extremely large percentage of the population who were native gaelic speakers from various islands.
I suspect the Donald Livingstone the family trees on Ancestry are talking about, is this one, Donald Livingstone, b. 04 Apr. 1731, OPR Birth 541/00 0010 015 Kildalton, on the OPR his birth place is Kinture, now called Kintra, which is around 20 miles from Bowmore, on Loch Indaal (Sp.?). I don't see anything connecting him with Morvern, so I may contact one of the people through Ancestry, to see if I can get any info on how they came to this conclusion,
John.
I noticed there was a Myles Livingstone who married a woman called McPherson in the Morvern area, they had a son Archibald, born or baptised at Morvern on 03 May 1812.There is no additional info on this Myles, or his family.
There was another Myles Livingstone, resident in Greenock in late 1700's, he married either an Agnes or Anne Blair, they had at least three children, John b. Jan. 1792, Catherine b. Dec. 1787 & Mary b. 1789, there is no indication of where this family originated from. As the only place Myles seems to appear as a Livingstone surname, is around Morvern, there is a fairly good chance they also came from the same area, also, Greenock had an extremely large percentage of the population who were native gaelic speakers from various islands.
I suspect the Donald Livingstone the family trees on Ancestry are talking about, is this one, Donald Livingstone, b. 04 Apr. 1731, OPR Birth 541/00 0010 015 Kildalton, on the OPR his birth place is Kinture, now called Kintra, which is around 20 miles from Bowmore, on Loch Indaal (Sp.?). I don't see anything connecting him with Morvern, so I may contact one of the people through Ancestry, to see if I can get any info on how they came to this conclusion,
John.
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Canadian Livingstone
- Posts: 2773
- Joined: Wed Jul 15, 2009 9:00 pm
Re: Misc.
Hi John,
Miles or Myles Livingston is not a common Livingston name in Western Argyllshire, but as Baron Niall Livingstone pointed out is found primarily in the Morvern and adjacent Lismore area. In fact Miles in MOrvern area was connected to the McInnes family and the name Miles McInnes appears in some records originating from MOrvern and Isle of Skye were some Morvern McInnes families settled. My ancestor may have been named Miles because of some McInnes family connection and indeed Livingstons and Mcinnes family members did marry at MOrvern including the most famous Morvern Livingston that of the parents of Donald Livingston 1728-1816 of Savary Morvern whose parents were John Livingston and Ann McInnis. There was a Miles McInnis at Savary, MOrvern I think at one point in the 1800's and I did not notice a couple of other Miles Livingstons as well. I think there were two on the Isle of Lismore including one that preceded the Miles born abt. 1775.
No the Kildalton Livingstons have nothing do with the Morvern Livingstons. I am actually in the process of trying to sort out whether or not some of them originated in Western Argyll or from a family of Livingston originating in the 1600's or early 1700's from the North of Ireland where there were families of Presbyterian Livingstons that may settled neighbouring Island Islay. The North of Ireland and the Island of Islay are a short distance from one another. The Vikings used the Island of Islay to stage raid on the North of IReland.
regards,
Donald
regards,
Donald
Miles or Myles Livingston is not a common Livingston name in Western Argyllshire, but as Baron Niall Livingstone pointed out is found primarily in the Morvern and adjacent Lismore area. In fact Miles in MOrvern area was connected to the McInnes family and the name Miles McInnes appears in some records originating from MOrvern and Isle of Skye were some Morvern McInnes families settled. My ancestor may have been named Miles because of some McInnes family connection and indeed Livingstons and Mcinnes family members did marry at MOrvern including the most famous Morvern Livingston that of the parents of Donald Livingston 1728-1816 of Savary Morvern whose parents were John Livingston and Ann McInnis. There was a Miles McInnis at Savary, MOrvern I think at one point in the 1800's and I did not notice a couple of other Miles Livingstons as well. I think there were two on the Isle of Lismore including one that preceded the Miles born abt. 1775.
No the Kildalton Livingstons have nothing do with the Morvern Livingstons. I am actually in the process of trying to sort out whether or not some of them originated in Western Argyll or from a family of Livingston originating in the 1600's or early 1700's from the North of Ireland where there were families of Presbyterian Livingstons that may settled neighbouring Island Islay. The North of Ireland and the Island of Islay are a short distance from one another. The Vikings used the Island of Islay to stage raid on the North of IReland.
regards,
Donald
regards,
Donald
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jmlivingstone
- Posts: 533
- Joined: Thu Sep 10, 2009 10:34 pm
Re: Misc.
Quite some time ago, someone was looking for info on a Flora Livingstone Coates, who died in Greenock, I don't know if the person still uses the site or not, Flora was thought to have married a Mc Gaff or McGough.
I just came across the following in Greenock records, which would appear to be the right Flora;
1984 death at Greenock, Scotland, Flora Livinhgstone Coates, 82 years, wife of Simpson McGarr, GROS Data 640/00 0475.
John
I just came across the following in Greenock records, which would appear to be the right Flora;
1984 death at Greenock, Scotland, Flora Livinhgstone Coates, 82 years, wife of Simpson McGarr, GROS Data 640/00 0475.
John
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Canadian Livingstone
- Posts: 2773
- Joined: Wed Jul 15, 2009 9:00 pm
Re: Misc.
Hi John,
How many Livingston Coates can there be? Sounds like you found the right one.
regards,
Donald
How many Livingston Coates can there be? Sounds like you found the right one.
regards,
Donald
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jmlivingstone
- Posts: 533
- Joined: Thu Sep 10, 2009 10:34 pm
Re: Misc.
A slightly different one here, a Livingstone who emigrated from Canada to the UK in the 1800's;
1. 1871 Census, Blackpool, Lancashire,
John Livingstone, age 32, b. Ontario, Canada, occ. labourer on pier, resident 8, Back Clinton St., Blackpool, with wife Jane.
2. 1901 Census, Barrow-in-Furness, Lancashire,
John Livingstone, age 63, b. Ontario, Canada, occ. engineers labourer, resident, 95, Cavendish St., Barrow-in-Furness, Lancs.,
wife, Jane ?????, age 63, b. Llanbedr, Merionethshire, Wales.
No further information on who the parents of this John were, or if they emigrated from Scotland, then returned to the UK,
John.
1. 1871 Census, Blackpool, Lancashire,
John Livingstone, age 32, b. Ontario, Canada, occ. labourer on pier, resident 8, Back Clinton St., Blackpool, with wife Jane.
2. 1901 Census, Barrow-in-Furness, Lancashire,
John Livingstone, age 63, b. Ontario, Canada, occ. engineers labourer, resident, 95, Cavendish St., Barrow-in-Furness, Lancs.,
wife, Jane ?????, age 63, b. Llanbedr, Merionethshire, Wales.
No further information on who the parents of this John were, or if they emigrated from Scotland, then returned to the UK,
John.
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jmlivingstone
- Posts: 533
- Joined: Thu Sep 10, 2009 10:34 pm
Re: Misc.
Another Kilpatrick, Isle of Mull, Livingstone family resident, possibly one of the last on Mull.
I have no idea where Mary or her parents fit in, but I would be very surprised if all Livingstones in Kilpatrick were not related to each other. So there's a good chance this could be further family of Angus from Kilpatrick & Shiaba.
Mary Livingstone, d. 03 May 1860 @ 90 years old, single & a pauper, buried in Kilpatrick cemetery, Isle of Mull.
Her parents were Neil Livingstone, occ. cowherd, & probably Christian Boyd, the surname is difficult to read, could be Christina.
At some point Mary married a McGilvray, surname unknown, & had a son named Lachlan.
John.
Nov. 2014 - I now have death cert for Mary & Lachlan, also Perth prison records for Lachlan.
I have no idea where Mary or her parents fit in, but I would be very surprised if all Livingstones in Kilpatrick were not related to each other. So there's a good chance this could be further family of Angus from Kilpatrick & Shiaba.
Mary Livingstone, d. 03 May 1860 @ 90 years old, single & a pauper, buried in Kilpatrick cemetery, Isle of Mull.
Her parents were Neil Livingstone, occ. cowherd, & probably Christian Boyd, the surname is difficult to read, could be Christina.
At some point Mary married a McGilvray, surname unknown, & had a son named Lachlan.
John.
Nov. 2014 - I now have death cert for Mary & Lachlan, also Perth prison records for Lachlan.
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Canadian Livingstone
- Posts: 2773
- Joined: Wed Jul 15, 2009 9:00 pm
Re: Misc.
Hi John,
I dont remember precisely when old Donald Livingston born abt. 1775 of SHiaba etc Ross of Mull died at Ross of Mull but I do remember it was after 1855 and it recorded as I suspect his father as Neil Livingston. I should look up in an old posting here what I wrote down from the death record. I do remember his father was clearly was Neil Livingston as we had suspected from the 1779 SHeba, Ross of Mull info. Donald's children ended in Grey County, Ontario Canada in the 1840's or 1850's. The family was financially strapped and Donald and his wife stayed behind at Ross of Mull ending up as paupers. Definitely this Donald was the same Donald Livingston mentioned as having a brother Angus in 1779 and being the son of a Neil Livingston of Shiaba, Ross of Mull. I am pretty certain there were likely other children and think that there was a Neil Jr. and possibly another son. I noticed a couple of Livingstons not many in th e southern Ross of Mull area in the early 1800's who could have been kin to Donald and ANgus, but of course I could not prove it.There could also have been a daughter or daughters and one you mentioned couild have been a sister of Angus and Donald. Her age is right about right as is her location I suspect.
Donald Livingston died in 1866 and his parents were listed as Neil Livingston and Christina Campbell which is odd because his wife's name was known to have been Christina or Cirsty Campbell. I am wondering if her first name like his wife's was Christina and they got he last name wrong on the record.
regards,
Donald
I dont remember precisely when old Donald Livingston born abt. 1775 of SHiaba etc Ross of Mull died at Ross of Mull but I do remember it was after 1855 and it recorded as I suspect his father as Neil Livingston. I should look up in an old posting here what I wrote down from the death record. I do remember his father was clearly was Neil Livingston as we had suspected from the 1779 SHeba, Ross of Mull info. Donald's children ended in Grey County, Ontario Canada in the 1840's or 1850's. The family was financially strapped and Donald and his wife stayed behind at Ross of Mull ending up as paupers. Definitely this Donald was the same Donald Livingston mentioned as having a brother Angus in 1779 and being the son of a Neil Livingston of Shiaba, Ross of Mull. I am pretty certain there were likely other children and think that there was a Neil Jr. and possibly another son. I noticed a couple of Livingstons not many in th e southern Ross of Mull area in the early 1800's who could have been kin to Donald and ANgus, but of course I could not prove it.There could also have been a daughter or daughters and one you mentioned couild have been a sister of Angus and Donald. Her age is right about right as is her location I suspect.
Donald Livingston died in 1866 and his parents were listed as Neil Livingston and Christina Campbell which is odd because his wife's name was known to have been Christina or Cirsty Campbell. I am wondering if her first name like his wife's was Christina and they got he last name wrong on the record.
regards,
Donald
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Canadian Livingstone
- Posts: 2773
- Joined: Wed Jul 15, 2009 9:00 pm
Re: Misc.
Hi John,
It looked like Christina or Christian Boyd to me as well.
Not alot of Boyd families in Southern Ross of Mull at the beginning of 1800, but there is some indication there was may have been one. A Duncan Boyd of Carsaig in southern most ROss of Mull married Christy Maclean. It is possible that Christian or Christina Boyd born abt. 1770 was a sister or kin of some sort given that the parish records indicate that Boyd was not a common family name in Ross of Mull. On the same page was listed persons who lived at Creich and some Livingtons at one time lived there. So it conceivable that Neil Livingston's wife was a Boyd. Certainly four letters and it looks like Boyd to me as well.
regards,
Donald
It looked like Christina or Christian Boyd to me as well.
Not alot of Boyd families in Southern Ross of Mull at the beginning of 1800, but there is some indication there was may have been one. A Duncan Boyd of Carsaig in southern most ROss of Mull married Christy Maclean. It is possible that Christian or Christina Boyd born abt. 1770 was a sister or kin of some sort given that the parish records indicate that Boyd was not a common family name in Ross of Mull. On the same page was listed persons who lived at Creich and some Livingtons at one time lived there. So it conceivable that Neil Livingston's wife was a Boyd. Certainly four letters and it looks like Boyd to me as well.
regards,
Donald