McLea/MacLea from Glasgow to Massachusetts

[Kyle MacLea]

Hi all,

Some of you may have looked at my (not recently updated) Family Wiki that I made some time ago. I call it the MacLea FamilyWiki:

http://kitenet.net/~kyle/family/wiki/

I've made quite a bit of progress, mostly through the help of other knowledgeable folk on the internet, including our Forum. There are two substantial weak spots in my records, though:

1. Prior to the marriage of my ancestors John McLea and Janet (Jessie) McKay, I have not been able to prove without a doubt John's origins. He died around 1833 judging by PO directories and the fact that his wife is living alone with her children in the 1841 Census:

http://kitenet.net/~kyle/family/wiki/jo ... _41__.html

Though Janet herself comes from Bute, I have not been able to prove with absolute certainty that John originates there.

I recently made contact with some of my cousins who descend from John's granddaughter, Margaret McLea Yuile, sister of my immigrant ancestor. They agree that their relatives spoke of a connection to Bute, and actually to Glendaurel hamlet before that (site of Kilmodan parish, consistent with the story from the Account of McLea of physician McLeas who were allied with the Lamonts). So, this is good knowledge to have.

But I'm always looking for more evidence of John's origins. If anyone has any additional ideas, I would love to hear them!

2. John's grandson James Brown McLea (MacLea) was my immigrant ancestor (my great-great-grandfather). His descent from John and John's son Peter is quite well documented in Census and Birth records in Scotland.

Though I have James Brown McLea's birth record, everything about his early life and his travel to the US is basically an enigma.

Other than his birth record, 1861 and 1871 census records, James disappears from all of my records until he reappears in Chicago in 1883 upon the birth of his first child, Margaret.

http://kitenet.net/~kyle/family/wiki/ja ... _41__.html

http://kitenet.net/~kyle/family/wiki/migrate.html

Our hypothesis is that he came via Canada, but we have no proof of that. In addition, James ends up in Paterson, New Jersey, where he was employed as a Jeweler, by 1884-1885, and lasting until summer 1897 (when they moved to Cambridge, Massachusetts). Other than a directory listing in Paterson for 1891-1893, and the cemetery records for his wife and daughter in 1894 and 1897, I have no other records of the family in New Jersey. This includes birth records for ALL of the children. My great grandfather Peter MacLea (McLea) is one of those born in New Jersey, but with no record existing of that birth.

Also, especially frustrating is the lack of any record on his first wife, Margaret Turner, who was apparently born in Glasgow, to Alex and Margaret Turner, but I can find no trace of her family. The worst part is finding no record of her marriage to James, which I would really love to have!

Anyone have any ideas on how to fill in the gaps in James's life? Or ideas on how to approach John's origins on Bute?

Ideas appreciated! Just goes to show you that even those of us who have been around quite a while on the Forum don't have all of our answers!

Kyle=

[Roberta Ann]

Hi Kyle;

I checked the Nova Scotia listings for McLeas'.

Frederick McLea Sutherland b. June 21, 1894 in Lockport. Residing in Lockport and Shelburne, N.S

1901 Census age 7. Married at age 36 in Calgary, Alberta to Dorothy Isobel McNichol.

Died Sept. 1983, age 89; in Las Vegas, Clark, Nevada.

I didn't find any with the surname McLea.

There is also Wishart McLea Robertson - Politician - moved to Brooklyn

Regards;

Roberta

[Canadian Livingstone]

Hi Kyle,

It is frustrating with John McLea and Janet McKay's Glasgow marriage record that there is not more info included. Such is the case with most of those early records. In the Miles Livingston and Janet Livingston's Kilarrow Parish marriage record of 1812 from the Isle of Islay I was amazingly lucky that the Church of Scotland minister at Bowmore wanted to distinquish between those born in his Parish and those who were not of Kilarrow Parish and the Isle of Islay so he deliberately made the effort to record the fact Miles and his wife Janet were natives of Morvern Parish and not originally from Bowmore, Kilarrow Parish or the isle of Islay at all in the marriage entry. Also something that was very odd was that he wrote a line in the marriage entry indicating they were boarding the vessel "Staffa" heading for America. By America he meant British North America. Such detail was helpful as I would not have known they were from Morvern but would have assumed they were born and from the Kilarrow Parish in the Isle of Islay which MIles apparently lived at for a few years before leaving for British North America in June of1812. Only fairly recently did I discover that one of Lord Selkirk's highland agents Archie MacDonald from Glencoe was given the task in the Spring of 1812 of arranging for the schooner Staffa to pick up both the Northern Mull settlers at Tobermory and also a few Isle of Islay settlers including Livingsons and take them to the port of Sligo, Ireland where the Hudson Bay COmpany vessel Robert Taylor waited to take them on their ocean journey to British North American on their way to Lord Selkirk's Red River settlement. But this is very rare that an early marriage record tells me anything of great significance. They are usually minimal in information.

I have always felt that your assumption that your ancestor John McLea was from Rothesay,Bute to be a safe one given his wife's origins there that I assume you located in the census records. It is great pity that there are no detailed census records prior to 1841 and 1851 that would have given us more info on John and his families history in Scotland. I dont know know what quantity of McLeas there were at Bute in the 1600's and 1700's but there numbers are certainly not that high in the 1840's and 1850's I presume you have noticed. Just a few families actually. Possibly some left for other parts of Scotland looking for work or to America and Australia. Have you been in contact with any McLeas whose ancestors went to Australia in the 1800's? Maybe some of them are related to you.

regards,

Donald

[Kyle MacLea]

Frederick McLea Sutherland b. June 21, 1894 in Lockport. Residing in Lockport and Shelburne, N.S

1901 Census age 7. Married at age 36 in Calgary, Alberta to Dorothy Isobel McNichol.

Died Sept. 1983, age 89; in Las Vegas, Clark, Nevada.

Yes, apparently this is one of the ancestors of the famous acting family. I tried, but didn't put in too much effort, to find out where the McLea middle name came from in this family. I am curious!

http://www.kiefersutherlandhome.com/200 ... r-25-2008/

Wishart McLea Robertson

I've also been in touch with the family of Wishart McLea Robertson, once Speaker of the Senate of Canada.

His descendant Bruce Robertson told me this about his family:

"apparently he was named that after one of his ancestors. . . a great, great grandfather named John McLea who lived from the mid 1700s to early 1800s. John came from the town of Forres in Morayshire, Scotland and reportedly served in the commissariat of the British Army at the time of the American Revolution. In 1784 he and his wife Isabella (maiden name unknown) arrived in Nova Scotia, where they received a land grant on the Clyde River, Shelburne County, NS in early 1785. They remained there for the rest of their lives.

To the best of our knowledge, John and Isabella McLea had only four daughters and no sons, so there were no descendents bearing the McLea name (except in cases where it was used as a middle name, as with my grandfather).

My research indicates John may have had a brother named James McLea who served in the Northern Gordon Fencible regiment based in Inverness Scotland between 1778 and 1783. One of John and Isabella`s closest neighbors on the Clyde River, John Stalker, also served in that fencible regiment at the same time as James McLea, and later married one of John and Isabella`s daughters after he too settled at Clyde River in 1785."

I have to wonder if these two families are in fact related.

Thanks for checking, Roberta!

Kyle=

[Kyle MacLea]

There is a family of MacLeas which traveled to the US via Newfoundland who became the MacLeas of Baltimore, Maryland. They were famous for their lumber business and are now spread around the country, but with the largest numbers in Maryland. This is similar to the fact that my family is spread around too, but still finds its largest numbers in New England (especially Massachusetts).

The MacLeas of Baltimore came from Greenock originally, not too far from my MacLeas. I continue to want to test this family for DNA connections but since we have both hit a dead-end on paper trail research at the moment we cannot connect that way. I have been in touch with members of this family and know their tree back to Scotland quite well (or at least I have it filed away!).

Kyle=

[Kyle MacLea]

It is frustrating with John McLea and Janet McKay's Glasgow marriage record that there is not more info included. ...They are usually minimal in information.

You got that right! This is the actual record:

Parish of Glasgow County of Lanark

McLAE John McLAE, Smith, in Glasgow + Janet McKAY, residents there, Married 27th Nov. by Mr. John BARR, Relief Min. in Glasgow.

The above particulars are extracted from a register of Banns and Marriages, dated 27th November 1818, Given under the Seal of the General Register Office, New Register House, Edinburgh on 19th May 2004.

I have always felt that your assumption that your ancestor John McLea was from Rothesay,Bute to be a safe one given his wife's origins there that I assume you located in the census records. It is great pity that there are no detailed census records prior to 1841 and 1851 that would have given us more info on John and his families history in Scotland.

Indeed. I think the evidence is pretty good:
1. Wife came from there, born 1795 in Rothesay. Identified as such in Scottish censuses.
2. Naming convention. Following the naming convention, there is only one John McLea in Rothesay in the correct time frame: the son of Duncan McLea and Margaret Fisher born in May 1790. Going from this Duncan and Margaret, I can go back to Duncan's grandfather Archibald, who was born sometime around the earliest records in Bute and so may have just missed having his birth recorded. I've drawn this out in a picture on my wiki:
http://kitenet.net/~kyle/family/wiki/sc ... _tree.html Everything from Duncan up to Archibald I feel is on pretty good ground looking at the records of Rothesay from this whole timeline.
3. All the other recorded John McLeas on Bute are unlikely given naming conventions and ages at the time of marriage/birth of children. Similarly, unrecorded John McLeas are also a possibility, however, the parish records are fairly complete on Bute at the time (few later additions recorded) and so there are probably few missing children there.
4. There aren't very many Johns in the database as a whole from the whole of Scotland in the correct time frame. And none that meet the naming convention OTHER than the one I found above.
5. John's father-in-law being a Smith in the same parish as John provides a context for John being able to meet the daughter of the local Blacksmith (and run away with her to the big city to get married?).

For his death, we have only the evidence from his listings as a blacksmith in the Glasgow Post Office directories. He is first recorded in 1823 at 13 Hospital street. His last entry is in 1833 at the same address. John McLea presumably died sometime between his last listing in 1833 and the 1841 census, and probably closer to 1833, because he is listed every year from 1826 to 1833, but then disappears suddenly.

Since few death or burial records exist from the era, we will probably never know his date of death, nor the place of burial, especially since gravestones for "poor folk" were unheard of. Checks of well-known places in Glasgow have yet yielded nothing.

I dont know know what quantity of McLeas there were at Bute in the 1600's and 1700's but there numbers are certainly not that high in the 1840's and 1850's I presume you have noticed. Just a few families actually. Possibly some left for other parts of Scotland looking for work or to America and Australia.

Ask and you shall receive.... It certainly seems like in the decade or so before my ancestors left that everyone else in the family was doing the same.

Date Rothesay McLea births Marriages (either partner)
1690s 9 3
1700s 3 0
1710s 7 6
1720s 14 9
1730s 12 3
1740s 7 6
1750s 5 3
1760s 9 4
1770s 15 4
1780s 13 7
1790s 21 3
1800s 11 9
1810s 7 4
1820s 4 2
1830s 2 5
1840s 6 1
1850s 4 3
1860s 7 1
1870s 2 0
1880s 0 0
1890s 4 3
1900s 2 1

Have you been in contact with any McLeas whose ancestors went to Australia in the 1800's? Maybe some of them are related to you.

I keep looking for McLeas anywhere in the world to compare notes. Few people have ever responded to me, alas!

I did recently find the descendants of that sister of my immigrant ancestor, who did go to Australia and found that valuable information, but alas, no other McLeas that I've contacted have been interested in discussing their family history with me.

Kyle=

[Jewel]

Hello Kyle,

I couldn't find much on James Brown McLea in Chicago,Illinois. The only thing I saw was the birth record for Maggie Brown McLea. Born June 7, 1883 Cook County Ill. Chicago. parents James Brown McLea born Sct. and Maggie McLea(Turner) b. Sct. Living on 930, 38th st. Chicago Illinois.

In the 1900 U.S. Census for County Middlesex,Cambridge, Mass.I find James B. McLea a widow, with children. What is strange is that in the 1900 census all of the children are stated as being born Mass. and then in the 1910 census they are listed as being born in New Jersey. So this might cause a problem when looking for any record of the childrens birth record.

James B. McLea b. Sct. Oct. 1859 widow Immigrated 1879 at age 21 and NA.
Margaret Dau. b. Mass. June 1884
Nettie " b. " Dec. 1885
James son b. " Jan. 1887
Peter " b. " July 1889
Mary dau. b. " June 1890
Alexander son b. " Oct. 1892
Belle dau. b. " Oct. 1895


In the 1910 census for Mass. James is still a widow and childreln are listed as being born New Jersey.

In the 1920 census James is living with daughter Nettie, she is listed as being born New Jersey, who is married to a Thomas R. Small in Watertown Mass.their childrlens names are Thomas, James, Charlie, and Ruth.


James B. McLea is married with wife Mary(second wife?) and daughter Isabelle, single, age 24, b. New Jersey.

You mentioned you had no birth records for any of the children of James B. McLea, since they are listed with different birth places in the different census I can see where that might be difficult to figure out.

Anyway if you want any more details from these census records let me know.

Jewel Brown

[Kyle MacLea]

Thanks, Jewel! It's always great to have a second set of eyes verify what you've found and see that it makes sense. Your records line up with mine exactly.

That is all I found in Chicago as well. It's a weird record.... it actually had James Brown McLea written in and then "Lea" is crossed out and "Kleeve" is written over it. This is a blessing, actually, because it verifies our families unusual pronunciation of "Lee" for "Lea" rather than "Lay." But it's really strange that Maggie's birth is the first record of James and Margaret (Turner) that shows up. We have no marriage record, no travel records to the US, no indication they were leaving the country, etc. The last record I have of James in Scotland is the 1871 Census. Then he disappears until 1883 in Chicago. Darn you, poor record keeping!

Yes, it is strange about the 1900 census showing the children were born in Mass. I can only assume that is because the information was given by someone who didn't know any better. My grandfather when he was alive knew very well that his father and aunts and uncles were born in Paterson, New Jersey. Obviously, someone who knew better was present for the 1910 and 1920 censuses. The Paterson directory for the early 1890s verified their presence there.

But writing to the State of New Jersey failed to locate any birth records for these children.

Interestingly, the only birth record for ANY of the children is Maggie's birth in Chicago in 1883, as far as I know. Which is ironic, because I didn't even know about Maggie's existence until a few years ago when I talked to a cousin who had tracked down her descendants... and then I later found the birth record. The reason why my grandfather didn't know about her is because she died very young. She died in Feb 1918, less than a year after my grandfather was born. This actually turns out to have been true of most of the family, since other people interested in the old family records didn't have her recorded either.

BTW, yes, Mary is James' second wife. Mary Hughes was her name. He went back to Scotland to get her and then returned to the states in 1911. They never had any children. And James died in 1926 so he was missed in the 1930 census.

I really appreciate you taking a look at the records for me, as well, Jewel!

I'm actually just noticing I had found a travel record for a James McLea coming to the US in 1879, 1880, and 1882. I need to look at those records again and see if they yield any additional information.


Kyle=

[Jewel]

Hello Kyle,

Yes I wondered about Maggies birth record stateing McKleeve. but I figured you had this record and would understand what it meant.

The other thing that caught my eye, was on Maggie's birth record it stated her mother Maggie Turner was born Scotland and then in the census for 1920 their daughter Nettie who is married to Thomas Small it states her mother's birth was stated as English.
It is strange that none of the children's births are recorded with the state. You could look for church records I guess for a baptism.

Did you try to get James McLea's Naturalization papers? I noticed there are different dates for his immigration to the states the 1900 said 1879 and the 1910 census was very difficult to read, but could have been 1882, then the 1920 stated 1880. The 1900 census said he was Naturalized so he did that before 1900.

Ok , glad to be of any help.

Jewel

[Kyle MacLea]

Hi Jewel,

I didn't myself look for James's naturalization record, but I wonder if he was ever actually naturalized or if he/others just said it for the Census taker.

My cousin Cynthia looked up until 1966 and could find no record of a naturalization.

But I don't really know how to go about looking for these records, so if you have any idea, I would appreciate it!

As for Margaret Turner's birth, that is interesting. I must have noted that, but I haven't really explored that too much.

I do have Margaret's death record from New Jersey in 1897. She died from septicemia, and it has always been passed down in the family that this was due to childbirth. It is POSSIBLE this could be the case, although her last child Isabella (the second of that name, the first having died in 1894), was born about October 1896, and Maggie didn't die until Feb 1897, so this would have been a prolonged infection if that was the case. Anyway--on the death record it gives her birthplace as Scotland and her parents as Alex and Margaret Turner, both also born Scotland. This information obviously must have come from James, so I think it is likely correct. He had little reason to lie if he was hiding her origins, but I suppose you never know. (Given that they were in NJ and had been for years, I don't think even if Margaret ran away to get married that it would have been necessary to hide her birthplace or parentage.)

Thanks so much, Jewel!

Kyle=