Hugh Livingstone 1808

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Canadian Livingstone
Posts: 2736
Joined: Wed Jul 15, 2009 9:00 pm

Re: Hugh Livingstone 1808

Post by Canadian Livingstone »

Hi allanl,

One suggested Duncan Livingston son of Neil Livingston and Mary Morrison that I have seen mentioned in the past and am more familiar with was a Duncan Livingston married to a Christian Beaton and who resided in Lettermore, Kilninian Parish, Mull as did Neil LivingstonSr. and Mary Morrison in the 1770's. In fact Neil and Mary were married in 1774 in Lettermore, Mull and their eldest children Mary (not listed in John Livingstone's 1892 letter to a Scottish Canadian historian) and a their eldest son John Livingston b.1777 also were apparently born in Lettermore, Mull. I consider this Duncan Livingston to be possibly the most likely Duncan Livingston son of Neil Livingston and Mary Morrison. But I am by no means 100 percent certain of this family connection in Mull. He could also have been a first cousin of the children of Neil Livingston and Mary Morrison but not a son. What is lacking is some tangible proof. So at this point I am most comfortable just stating that particular Mull, Duncan Livingston is a possibly a son of Neil Livingston and Mary Morrison but not proven.

Most of Duncan Livingston and Christian Beaton's children in the 1800's settled in Lanark County, Upper Canada and I was in touch via the Forum with a direct descendant and another Livington researcher not related to Canadian Livingstons some years ago passed on to me by mail some very detailed family history of Duncan Livingston and Christian Beaton's children who settled in Upper Canada (Ontario Canada) in the that someone had mailed to her years ago. Since my move I have not be able to find that file much to may distress, but I recall some of the info. Most interesting in that file was a photocopy from a 1950's new's article stating that an elderly descendant of one of the children of Duncan Livingston and Christian Beaton who lived at that time in Ontario had an old Livingston family bible connected to the Blantyre Livingstone family of Dr. Livingstone. I have since wondered what became of that bible after the elderly owner passed away perhaps in the 1950's.

Most interesting is that Dr. Livingstone's brother John Livingstone of Canada in an 1870's interview with a journalist alludes to having a Livingston cousin that had lived in the Highland Line in Lanark County, Ontario. This could only have been one of Livingston sons of Duncan Livingston and Christian Beaton who settled in Lanark County in the 1800's. Also important to note that John Livingstone older brother of Dr. Livingstone who settled in Ontario, Canada in the early 1840's also resided up to around 1860 in Lanark County, Ontario before moving to the Listowel, Ontario area and becoming a local merchant for many years.

It is my understanding from the family info I have seen that there were apparently 5 sons and three daughters which were John, Charles Duncan, Donald, Mary, Margaret and Catharine born to Neil Livingstone and Mary Morrison. I can't confirm that Neil and Mary had additional children after 1792 when they were by then residing in lowland Blantyre, Lanarkshire. I have not seen any proof that they did. A surviving 1792 document from Mull, Argyll officials most interestingly states that Neil Livingstone was departing from Mull with 4 sons and 3 daughters. This does not negate the possibility that they had 5 children born before 1792 in Mull, just that one must have died before their 1792 departure from Mull to Blantyre, Lanarkshire. It also suggests that either son Duncan or Donald Livingston did likely live to adulthood and marry and have family. And this presents a challenge to the notion that one of the adult Livingston men I have suspected are sons of Neil Livingston and Mary Morrison may not infact be a son of Neil Livingston and Mary Morrison. Y DNA testing of the descendants of Duncan Livingstons and Donald Livingstons suspected to possible sons of Neil Livingston and Mary Morrison would quickly determine whether they were possibly a son of Neil and Mary unfortunately I have not been able to find a Livingston descendant of either the Duncan or Donald Livingston I suspected might be children of Neil and Mary Livingston. In your case your Y DNA test definitely confirmed your Duncan Livingston is no way a Y DNA match with a Livingston ancestrally connected to Dr. Livingstone's grandfather Neil Livingston of Mull, Argyll and later after 1792 Blantyre, Lanarkshire. Having a proven descendant of Neil Livingston tested as I did years ago has turned out to be most helpful in regards to sorting out who is related to Dr. Livingstone's Mull Livingstone family and who is not.



I see quite a few errors over the years in submitted info online regarding Neil Livingston and Mary Morrison's descendants and Livingstons claiming be to related some how to Dr. Livingstone's family and in some cases they have actually constructed their Livingstone family tree with a speculative link to Dr. Livingstone's Livingstone family group. My Father and grandfather used to think that our Livingston family was also in some way related to Dr. Livingstone and this I have found over the years to be very common amongst Livingstons and those related to Livingstons who have contacted the Forum over the years. The one I earlier commented on was apparently a submission I assume on the the Mull Genealogy info I noticed linking your ancestor Duncan Livingston as a son of Neil Livingston and Mary Morrison. That was actually the first time I had come across that particular error. It may be elsewhere. I have not checked into that or whether it is also inciuded in Ancestry.com family tree submissions. That may also be possible. I am not surprised if you have also found this info on other Scottish genealogy web sites I am not familiar with.

Scotland's People provides one with access to the original birth or baptism, marriage and in some cases available surviving death records and the 1841 to 1901 Scottish census online. It also offers some other additional information sources. The limiting factor is really is luck. Finding family records I have found over the years researching several of my related families that sometimes you get very lucky and sometimes not so lucky locating useful old family records. Sometimes you hit a treasure trove of rare family information and other times you end up reaching a dead end with nothing gained for your efforts.

Scotland's People may have records pertaining to a Livingston ancestor or it may not. Essentially you will only find whatever parish records have luckily managed to survive over the years. There are no doubt many early Argyllshire record pertaining to Maclea Livingstone families that were some some reason lost by the Parish minister or for some reason not recorded by the minister in his old Parish book. Some parishes in Argyllshire include surviving records beginning in the 1750's, but unfortunately as I found on Scotlands People the surviving Morvern Parish records birth and Marriage records from the old Church of Scotland Parish books do not begin until about 1803 or 1804, hence I am in the dark regarding Morvern births and marriages prior to the early 1800's which no doubt included the family of my great- great- great grandfather Miles Livingston. But I have always thought those regrettable limitations possibly due to the negligence of a Parish minister in the 18th century or someone years later. I have run into the frustration of researching various related families of a missing surviving records I know all to well the disappointment that brings.

This may sound silly but sometimes in the past I have forgotten to try all the spelling variations for Livingstone in the search feature which of course include Livingston and Levingston. Sometimes for example in the old Church of Scotland parish records for the Kilninian Parish you may notice the family name written as Levingston. Unless you try them all in your Livingston search of the birth/baptism and marriage records you might miss Livingstons recorded as Levingstons. I recommend typing in all three Livingstone spelling variations Livingstone, Livingston and Levingston in your Scottish Parish searches with Scotland People when doing a person search on that site.

I suspected you would have several Livingstone matches with that Bachuil Lismore Livingstone Y DNA match group as the earlier results with that Match group certain suggested that was and would continue to be the Case No doubt from your Y DNA test results your ancestrally connected somehow and some point in time with the Maclea Livingstone ancestors of the Bachuil, Lismore Livingstone family which of course includes our Clan Chief. I imagine you were excited when you first realized your likely ancestral connection with this old and historic Western Argyll Maclea Livingstone family group. Early on I also thought my Livingston ancestors might be ancestrally connected to the Bachuil Lismore Livingston as a Mile (Myles) Livingston was baptized in 1775 in Lismore Parish which was the birth year of my ancestor, however the Y DNA test proved my Livingston ancestor was ancestrally connected to the Bachuil Livingstones, but from a second predominate Maclea Livingstone Y DNA match group largely apparently of Mull and Morvern Livingston origins. Most of the Maclea Livingstone of Western Argyllshire seem to match with either the Bachuil Lismore LIvingtone group or this second Mull Morvern group which my Livingston cousin is a match with and with some others of mostly Islay Southern Argyllshire Livingston ancestry matching with a third Y DNA match group. This must be some sort of pattern because I am 100 percent certain something like 99 percent of those Livingstons of confirmed Argyllshire ancestry tested in the future will likely match with one of these 3 Y DNA groups.

regards,

Donald
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